Statements by U.S. Officials
NTV Interview with Deputy Assistant Secretary for Europe and Eurasian Affairs Matt Bryza
Nabucco Signing,
Rixos Hotel, Ankara
July 13, 2009
Question: So you are leaving the job I guess? Right?
Bryza: Well I mean at some point, I don't have definitive dates or exactly what will happen next, but I'm really honored that I was able to stay on for first the first six months of the new Obama Administration. And I think these have been a very productive six months.
Question: So what will be the next topic for you? Do you know?
Bryza: I probably can't talk about it, but what I really hope to do is to stay in this region that I care so much about and it's such a big part of my life and continues contributing to major projects and agreements we've been working on for all these years.
Question: Mr. Bryza first of all I would like to ask how you see the signing of this agreement today here in Ankara. What is the importance of this agreement in general for the Nabucco project?
Bryza: For the project itself as President Barosso just said we are witnessing the actual birth of the Nabucco Pipeline Project. I think it's been already born for a while, but this is the first and most concrete sign that the project is coming together. So what is going to be signed today is the legal framework for the project which also demonstrates the political support of Europe for Nabucco. So, it's important for the project itself. But it is also an important moment for the south Caucusus to feel Turkey's strong commitment to the continued prosperity of the region and also to the diversification of energy supplies and export routes for Europe which then elevates Turkey's strategic importance to both Europe and the south Caucasus.
Question: After today's event a new process will be starting which is to find the natural gas to fill this pipeline. Is the U.S. Administration planning to support that process just like we have seen until now? And who are the most probable suppliers according to U.S. Administration? We know that in the past you have stated your opposition to Iran's participation to this project. How do you see Iran's and Russia's participation and who are the most probable suppliers according to you?
Bryza: Well of course we are going to continue. We have been doing, as actively as anyone, is helping the countries that will be the main suppliers accelerate their production of gas and then work out agreements with consumers of that gas. What happened today was a very important step in clearing a way for those commercial agreements on the sales of gas to happen. But we've been extremely active working with the most important country for the start of Nabucco which is Azerbaijan. Without question Azerbaijan is the country from which the initial large volumes of gas for Nabucco will come. And also for the Turkey-Greece-Italy pipeline I might add Azerbaijan has huge volumes of gas already discovered. Some would argue perhaps enough gas to fill Nabucco as well as the Turkey-Greece-Italy Pipeline, but maybe not at the right time. There is a lot of gas in the ground. To get it out of the ground and into pipelines at the right time requires huge amount of coordination and investment and so, I think what will see is Azerbaijan providing the initial volumes of gas and then other countries stepping in over the next few years. Perhaps Turkmenistan, perhaps Iraq will fill Nabucco, while Azerbaijan produces more and more gas and allows additional export routes to be created. As far as Iran is concerned the international community has a pretty clear policy toward Iran and even if we didn't though we see Iran is unable to produce enough gas for its own population at this point. Tabriz and Tehran have difficulty getting enough gas in winter. We have seen in recent years that Iran was unable to export the gas it had committed to Turkey. In fact, it's a maybe a coincidence but when Turkmenistan stopped sending gas to Iran, Iran stopped sending gas to Turkey.
Question: Don't you see Iran as a reliable country in those terms?
Bryza: Well I don't see Iran fulfilling its commitment to Turkey to supply gas to Turkey, so, that doesn't sound like it's fulfilling its contractual obligations, but leave that aside. It doesn't really matter what happens with Iran, because Iran's gas is not needed for the Nabucco Pipeline or the Turkey-Greece-Italy Pipeline. There is plenty of gas as I have said already in Azerbaijan, plus Iraq and Turkmenistan.
Question: What about Russia?
Bryza: Well, Russia already exports a huge volume of gas to Europe. 25 percent of all the gas that Europe consumes comes from one company in Russia. 63-64 percent of all of Turkey's gas comes from one company. And our experience in any economic situation is that if somebody wants a partnership with a major supplier of whatever commodity it is, that consumer can negotiate a better deal if the consumers have some leverage, has some options in addition to one major supplier. So, the focus of my government for a long time has been to help our European allies and Turkey do what they say they wish to do, which is to diversify their supplies of natural gas. If at some point Russia decides it would like to participate in this project or any of these southern quarter projects as a minority partner that owns as much as the project as the volume of gas that it ships through the project, that will be looked at. We want an energy partnership with Russia, of course we do. We don't want confrontation with Russia, but we do very much believe in the power of economic competition to generate economic efficiency.
Question: I would like to go on with other issues and continue with Turkey-Armenia relations. We have seen a statement made in April by Turkish-Swiss and Armenian Governments stating that there is a process going on to find an agreement to solve the problems. But we haven't seen much since then, so, are you expecting a deal, a breakthrough in the relations in this year, within this year, in near future? For example opening the borders?
Bryza: We certainly hope so. As was announced April 22nd Turkey and Armenia have agreed to a framework to normalize their relations and so we hope that that will be implemented and the two countries are talking about how best to do that. And we hope you didn't ask, but I should note that at the same time as the Turkey-Armenia process is moving so is the Nagora-Karabakh Peace Process. We know that those two processes are separate, but they are moving forward in parallel. Maybe at differing speeds, there is progress, maybe faster progress one day on one process then on another the other process, but as each process moves forward it pulls along the other one. They are helping each other generate a more positive mood throughout the region and among the countries, so they are separate and parallel but perhaps moving at different speeds.
Question: What is the situation regarding the negotiation between Armenia and Azerbaijan because Mr. Aliyev, the President of Azerbaijan said there is an OSCE plan to solve this issue. How mature is this plan and what is the level of negotiations?
Bryza: It's the first time I've been asked that question in Turkey and I am very glad you've asked it, because that's the most important question about Nagorno Karabakh. The plan is very mature, back in November 2007 the OSCE mediators, of which I am one, I'm the representative for the United States. I have a Russian colleague and a French colleague, we are group of three. We presented our ideas for the peace plan in Madrid at the meeting of Foreign Minister of the OSCE. And we are about to present an updated version of that plan in anticipation of the meeting just this coming Friday in Moscow of the presidents of Armenia and Azerbaijan. I was just in Azerbaijan and Armenia earlier this week and was able to meet repeatedly with the leaders of both countries and I can tell you that they feel momentum. They are starting to feel more optimistic. And I think they will, they are considering how to reach agreement. The last few elements of this peace plan that I described that we first presented in November of 2007.
Question: What does it contain? Could you tell more about this plan?
Bryza: President Aliyev made an announcement in Moscow just a few days ago and what he said is accurate. And in fact we the co-chair countries released a statement at the G-8 Summit and then a fact sheet that lays out what the plan is. So, the idea is that number one the seven territories around Azerbaijan, around Nagorno Karabakh will be returned to Azerbaijan over time and Azerbaijanis and all internally displaced persons will return to those territories. As President Aliyev said, some territories will be returned immediately, some will be returned with a bit of a delay with a few years. So the implementation will come in stages or in steps even though that agreement is a package agreement. So return of the seven territories around Nagorno Karabakh will receive an interim status that provides for the security of the Karabakh people, it allows them to manage their own lives both politically and economically. Then there will be a pledge for a vote to take place in the future; that will determine the final legal status of Nagorno Karabakh, so that's how the residents of Nagorno Karabakh gains self determination. What we are looking for is an agreement that balances self determination, territorial integrity and non use of force. So, in terms of non use of force, there will be International peace keepers, and arrangements to keep everybody comfortable that there won't be a return to war and finally there will be a corridor that links Armenia to Nagorno Karabakh across these returned Azerbaijani territories.
Question: As far as I can see that plan is very mature, what about the negotiations going on between Armenia and Turkey? Is there a mature plan in that process as well?
Bryza: There is, as I mentioned a moment ago there is a framework protocol that was agreed, as well as a time table. So, the point now is to implement those agreements, when both counties are comfortable doing so. We hope the implementation will accelerate now.
Question: Okay I have one last question regarding Iraq. There is an important process starting which is the withdrawal of U.S. soldiers from Iraq. I know that your main topics are Eurasia, but when U.S. Administration is withdrawing from Iraq, do you think there will be a demand from Turkey to use its ports and bases within this process?
Bryza: Well that's not a decision for the U.S. State Department, which I represent. That's a decision that our military commanders will make and with of course ultimately that our President will make. Whether to request that of Turkey and then we would have to see what Turkey's response would be. So I do not know where our military commanders are in terms of planning this sort of a withdrawal. We have such a strong and long history of cooperation with Turkey, not withstanding March 1st 2003 our cooperation with Turkey in Iraq has grown very strong. Turkey is about to send one of its most experienced diplomats Murat Ozcelik to be Ambassador. He is a great partner of ours as is the whole team including Sinirlioglu, Undersecretary Apakan, as well as Minister Davutoglu. We have worked very closely all of us together for many years to get U.S.-Turkish partnership in a position we are together we are contributing to the stability of Iraq and to go back to your first questions to the prosperity of Iraq and the development of its energy resources so they can also contribute to this sovereign corridor.
Question: Mr. Bryza thank you very much for answering our questions.
Bryza: Thank you for the great questions.